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Okay I was just thinking about this but.. Suicide is not the answer.

I have a friend, in real life, and she suffers from this. It's horrible. I won't say her name, I won't say anything about her... But let's say her name is "Berry". Well, my friend, Berry, harms herself and more. She goes to a therapist and now she is in a mental hospital. I love her and she is so sweet. She told me why she is like this.. Which I won't say because it's personal.

Suicide is NEVER the answer.
If your getting abused, tell someone.
If your having suicidal thoughts, confide in someone.
Feeling worthless? Tell someone.
And more!
JUST TELL SOMEONE.
Don't bottle in your emotions.

I had a time in my life where I felt worthless, fat, stupid, and ugly. But.. I told my two best friends. They did everything go help me, they made a appointment with a therapist, they made me feel as if I was something. They still stand by my side. They cried for me, stayed by my side in the times when it was rough..

I'm not here to grab about my friendship though.

That little story was an example, for you to tell someone. BUT DON'T TELL JUST ANYONE! you have to find so some you can trust, someone that will stay by your side.

Now the final message from me...

"You are you,
Are you are
Beautiful"

I think that's the part most have trouble with.

I completely agree with your post and feel it's worth mentioning! Suicide isn't the best choice.

Now, medicine and therapy are important resources to cure depression (a common cause of suicide), that's for sure! But it's equivalent to putting a bandage over a gaping wound. A wound that festers and grows because whatever caused it is still lodged in there. And even if you remove it, there's no guarantee it won't come back before the wound has a chance to heal. You can't control that person's life and make it better. Not even the one suffering can always do anything about it. If they could, a lot of people wouldn't even begin to consider suicide. It's usually the final option on anyone's list.

This is why it's so important to know how your actions and decisions regarding others affects their lives. You'll be opening a door for some, closing it for others. There will always be someone in need of help.

The most important resource for someone with depression is someone who cares. Someone who understands.

Trust takes time. Stories and melodramas can make you think people will open up to each other in a few days or fall in love in a week. This is only because conservation of detail. A way of staying relevant to the plot. Real life, unfortunately, is full of long periods where nothing important happens. Timing is key. Tell a friend how you're feeling, and if you haven't known them long, watch as they grow uncomfortable and inadvertently make you feel worse.

Not everyone has that much time. With each passing day, a little piece of them dies. When they can't be themselves because nobody can understand what they're going through, or just understand who they are as people (interests, beliefs, personality), it's a fate worse than death in their eyes. Tell them they're beautiful, but unless you truly know them, it'll be hard for them to take those words to heart.

I think we tend to underestimate how important love is. Without it, all that's left is pain.

Very wise words!

To anyone who needs help relating to this topic, please see the resources here:
https://www.rprepository.com/help/mental-health-resources

Not only do I not have that 'someone' to talk to, I can't even have any form of conversation with people or friends without being left in the dust after getting talked over (left out). Unless its for being the ultimate butt of everyone's jokes.

Oh... You can always talk to me, and I can help!

Dear 7th derp you can chat with me. I was the black sheep in my family. I was a outlaw to my in-laws in my first marriage. You're not the only one who has to cope with those kind of feelings.

This is a lovely post and also very brave, you should be proud of yourself for writing it.

I'm a survivor of childhood abuse, domestic, and a whole other list of not-so-fun things in life, have attempted suicide several times. Having come through the other side of my trauma I can advise that until you get the help and support you need and deserve there are 24hr helplines that are in place for people who are overwhelmed, no matter what your situation is there is always a kind soul out there who is willing to help and listen.

To all those struggling in life just know, that no matter how bad your circumstances are or feel, how dark it may seem, remember you are a strong and amazing person with a beautiful soul. Never let another person make you feel ashamed or doubt your worth, instead question the reason why they are lashing out - you are not the issue.

Do not punish yourself for feeling the way you do, you have a right to feel hurt, emotions are real and they are there for a reason. If you can - write down your struggles, place a pillow on your lap for the times you feel the urge to self harm so that instead of damaging yourself the pillow can be the punching bag. There are many techniques that I am happy to share, links to sites that have helped me and others, never be afraid to ask for help.

Never be ashamed of yourself or your story, one day it may inspire someone else

♡

Very important post indeed.

A friendly reminder that my inbox is always open to people who need to talk, chat and vent. It is a safe space.

Stay strong, lovelies.

Zoura speaks as if the problem was in the person, as if the person has to be fixed, as if the person hasn't been trying to connect, as if the person weren't repudiated at every attempt. I actually think the problem is in the world. Some people have been born in a good place, have laws that protect them, and better opportunities in life, others don't. How to take medicine solves that, huh? Oh, let's take medicine and live the rest of our lives being drugged to not see the world as it is, or get isolated in a mental institution to obtain the same effect. This is not a great solution, nor a good solution, maybe not a solution at all. I prefer a real coffee, even if it is bitter.

To be fair, that's about all they can do. An imperfect solution for an imperfect world. Fix the world, you fix the problem. It all starts with you and how your treatment of others affects them. My two cents.

Here's a pretty effective tongue-in-cheek satire on the state of a world that relies completely on medicine to make everything better. It doesn't make your life better. It just helps you feel different.
But not forever.

It's so much more important to fix the world than it is to apply temporary solutions, you're right. Medicine should come after what caused the symptoms is healed. That means changing that person's life around. Getting their needs met. Maslow's hierarchy is a fairly good measure of that. None of us have complete control over the circumstances of our own lives. However, others do. For instance: your landlord, your manager, your roommates, your parents... in many cases, people like this have more control over your life than you. It's their responsibility to be aware of this and be careful.

Unfortunately, it may be too late for some people. You know how doctors treat patients most in danger of dying first? They get them to a point where they're no longer in any immediate danger and quickly move on to the next. This is pretty much what you can expect with most suicide hotlines and similar resources, including medicine and therapy. They're a stop-gap measure, not a complete cure. They're meant to keep you in the game just a little while longer, in the hopes your life will get better in time. Sadly, that doesn't always happen, but for some, it will get better.

These resources are there to give them that chance.

I have to politely disagree with this. Sometimes it isn't the world that's at fault, no matter how much we can't control it, and it depends on the person's outlook on the world. For example, me. The world isn't so bad, I just choose to see it that way when I don't get my way or when I'm angry at it.

Yes, medicine and therapy is a temporary fix for suicidal people, but it's still a fix to keep them going, even if it's just for a few minutes longer. It's better than doing nothing. And I agree, some people are kicked down by life in a harsh way, and it's the world's fault on that. The world isn't perfect, nor will it ever be perfect. Why? Because we humans are not perfect. We fight, we betray, we kill, we violate, sometimes without thinking or even caring about the consequences.

But to me, it's also a matter of looking at oneself as well. Not everyone outside us is to blame for life being hard. If you don't think there's anything wrong with yourself and the whole world's at fault for making you so miserable, that's fine, and you may be right. But it's not a healthy way of thinking if there is something you can do.

I guess my coffee's too sweet because I put too much hope into it, but in my eyes, it's half world, half self (or even three-fourths world, one-fourth self). Take care of the self, try and change the self, then hope it changes the world, even if it's just someone giving you a second glance and maybe even a smile. "Be the change you want to see in the world." Even if it doesn't change anything, at least you tried. Sometimes it does change things for the better though.

But that's my take on the conversation. I'm running on fumes, and may have misread or misunderstood a few things here and there. My tone may have also seemed insensitive, which I didn't mean to come across as. (I'm someone who's tried to commit suicide many times in my life before mellowing out a while ago, so that's why I looked at this thread.) If so, I apologize and will edit my post if needed.

First off, thank you, Zoura for posting this topic. You gave words of encouragement and hope, and sometimes, that's all that we need. I think this was truly lovely, and the fact that it was completely random touches the heart even more so.

To the conversation that has sprung out of this, I too have been on the receiving end of abuse; different kinds and at different ages. However, as with most cases, abuse can leave scars on the psyche, which brings me to a sobering thought that I have seen happen before; you either surpass your abuse, or you continue the cycle. This fear has been with me since a young age, since my mother was the latter, without even realizing it.

You are the victim of abuse while it is happening to you, but it is also up to us to stop self abusing afterwards by still believing so lowly of ourselves, and treating our own selves as dirt. We are capable of many things, each and every one of us. The best we can do is surpass these things by taking care of ourselves, and showing our abusers, {or depression), that while they think they have control, ultimately we are the ones who control ourselves. And let me be clear, this is the truth. We are worth so much, and telling ourselves this can be excruciating, but I implore you not to give in. There are 24 hour help lines, there are counsellors and we have friends, and/or family. It can be hard simply to get yourself out of bed, but only you can pick up that phone and call. Only you can sit through that meeting with your counsellor.

Focusing on how cruel the world is, or that your abuser seems to be getting no karma for what they have done to you, is only keeping yourself in that endless void of negativity. You know who deserves the amount of energy that you're putting into that negativity? You. You could be using that hurt and that eagle-eye focus on how unfair everything is and turn it into how much you deserve love, respect and kindness. I know that this is easier said than done, but I believe that you can do it.

It is not easy looking in a mirror, and it is hard enough when you may already believe that you were gullible and naive, that perhaps you deserved whatever has happened to you, but the worst you can do is continue that mindset. Friends may be already banging at your door by always asking "Are you okay?" Be honest with them. They cannot help you or give you the support you need if you don't open up. And if they are too close to home, that's what the helplines are there for. Counsellors too. The answer isn't always medication, and it may feel like slapping a band-aid on it, but it's not. This is you taking some of the hardest steps you will ever take, standing up for yourself in the midst of all chaos and emotional turmoil shouting "I deserve better!" and damn rights, because you do.

I'm sorry! I should've been more clear in my own posts too. I was referring to people who can't do something to change their lives around. I understand there are people out there who can do something but don't realize it yet. In their cases, therapy is definitely a life-saver!
It opens their eyes to possibilities they might not have considered.

It's when all other options have been exhausted that my claims on the impact of love hold the most merit.

That's also when the world around the sufferer needs to change. Hence my agreement.

On the topic of how, "be the change you wish to see" is certainly true! But it's not enough on its own. How does one be a landlord that doesn't charge so much for rent because they know their tenants would go homeless without them? This is a cause that can't be solved by the victim- only the landlord taking advantage of them. Could the victim go somewhere else? How would they pay for it? Will they have a stable, well-paying job wherever they move? The answer isn't always yes.

The world certainly isn't perfect, nor will it ever be. Imperfect solutions. But merely being the change you wish to see doesn't always apply to the source of the problem. Telling that victim they need to change their attitude will, at best, make them feel worse. It's a case-by-case basis, and it's very important not to treat their lives like an assembly line.

If the cause isn't dealt with in a healthy and positive way, the one suffering won't get better. No matter how much they down pills, take therapy or put on a smile and think pleasant thoughts.

Always important to remember, people are people! Our lives aren't cut-and-dry. It's not always our fault. It's not always the world's fault. Look at the problem, find the cause and make sure they know they're not alone.

By the way, I love the discussion this is generating. It's wonderful that people are talking about it!

I'm sorry if my words came out wrong! I did not mean to harm anyone in the process.

But, as someone who has been experienced with severe depression and had some suicidal thoughts (not alot, probably like four) but I must admit that it the world is at fault sounds kind of.. Childish. Sorry, and I'm trying to say this polite, but it's kind of weird to say that. (Not trying to be mean)

Example 1:

Let's say I'm going to the store and someone calls me ugly and fat. Well, NOW it's my turn to choose whether I care or not. I could be strong and say, "Well that's your opinion." Or I can be sensitive and take it to heart, let it break me down. As you can see, it's OUR choice to let words of stuff get to us. It's not the world choice.

ALso, have you noticed that doctors, therapists, people in general are trying to help people with suicidal thoughts. Medicine will only work for some time, yes, but at least people in this WORLD are trying to help them. My friend, "Berry", is actually getting better in the hospital because she takes medicine and she talks to people with professional works. Berry actually blames herself for turning like she is now, not the world. Because right now, some parts in the world are doing their very best to help people like her.

I'm sorry if this came out as rude or anything, but I'm trying to state something. Have a good day!

No, no, it's alright! I'm happy hearing others' thoughts on this!

I've been so invested in this topic recently that it's hard not to talk about it. I literally have nobody else I can discuss it with except my professors, and they're usually busy. A close friend of mine is in a dark place right now, and it's not just words that caused it. She's hurting, and there's nothing I can do to save her. All I can do is buy her time. Help her find a therapist, get some medicine, delay the pain until it gets better. And it will. I tell her that every day.

We don't know each other very well. She's afraid of coming out and saying how she feels. Last time she did, the person literally responded by giving her the cold shoulder. It's an awful feeling that I'm all too familiar with. She only told me because I'm majoring in psychology.

Unless something changes in her life, it won't get better. I'm certain something will change one day. Everything will turn out fine. It has to. She needs that hope more than anything right now. It's an important part of the early recovery process.

But what if it doesn't? What if her life stays the same or gets worse?

Your claims are definitely applicable to many cases of severe depression!
But please don't forget the people to whom it doesn't apply. They need our help too, more than ever. They don't want to be forgotten.

I thought I'd post bits of a discussion on another forum about this very topic, which better presents my understanding. Some of them are folks suffering from crippling depression:

Awww....that's sweet.

I know some people that have some problems but it ends up being too toxic for me to handle sometimes but I think that's a different situation. It's hard to know how to set boundaries sometimes, with people who self harm and/or are feeling suicidal, in order to support them without losing yourself to a certain degree. I get the feeling that you are a natural comforter/nurturer. I totally get that, I am too. You're right, sometimes it helps just to listen to someone vent about their problems and to make them feel like they're worth something, because they are to you.


For me...Prozac helped! I was never a self-harmer but had suicidal thoughts (pmdd related) for a while and Prozac helped. A lot. Now I don't have them, but sometimes I still want someone to listen to my problems and let me cry on their shoulder! Lol. In my opinion we are almost all touched starved in this materialistic, productivity-driven society. Sometimes we need to just stop and give each other a freaking hug once in a while.

CSA and emotional abuse victim, represent.

Almost nine years ago to the day, I made a very serious suicide attempt. If not for an online friend, I wouldn't be here. He gave me tough love when I told him what I'd done (which I won't get into so as not to trigger), and it worked. It's worth reaching out to anyone in your support network because you never know whose words will save you. As he put it recently, "I don't know the outcome of not talking to me, but our conversation had a 100% success rate."

I know that not everyone has someone, but if you do...speak up. It's been a long decade of recovery, and I thank him every year for saving my life.

Mental health recovery isn't easy. No part of it is simple, but you need to be proactive. You need to try and be present in your own life, even when mental illness is lying to you and telling you that you can't. Celebrate small victories and work up to bigger ones.

I have complex ptsd and rapid cycling bipolar disorder, and my inbox is always open for people who just need to talk it out. I've been there, and I get it. It gets better one day at a time!

Can you put a content/trigger warning in the title of your forum post please? I feel like that should be required for this serious of a topic. I clicked on this completely unaware and it stirred some really unpleasant things. I'm sure other people would appreciate a warning as well....

I'm always really pleased when people talk openly about mental health. It's such an integral part of our health in general and still too much of a taboo that open discussions like this are really helpful.

I too would like a content warning in the title though! I wasn't prepared to be reading about suicide and self-harm it also caught me off guard quite a bit.

Something that I notice being brought up in this topic is that feeling (depressed) is a choice, and subsequently being depressed is too. (Edit: I should have clarified that this was the impression I got from some of the phrasing in some posts - I may be wrong! But just as a reminder even if I did misinterpret it, because some people in the world do still insist on this:) This is not true - we don't choose how we feel or see the world, perspective is something we develop based on our circumstances and the influences from our social circles and feelings just happen. It would be more accurate to say that in most cases, most people have a choice on how to react to these feelings and to the awareness of their perspective. They often have a choice to reach out to others and get help, they have a choice to evaluate their own feelings and work through them in a way that is productive and helpful.

And sometimes they don't have a choice.

I will always encourage telling people to speak up because often times, people with depression get really good at hiding it and it's not always obvious.

On the other hand, this puts full responsibility on the depressed person, who may be entirely unable to tell anyone about this because that is a very big symptom of depression. Depression can make you unable to tell someone even if you really, really want to. Telling someone costs a lot of energy. Telling someone can be terrifying if you haven't been told it's okay to be depressed and have been subjected to negative stereotypes on mental health. Depression makes you retreat and isolate yourself in many cases and by the time someone may even realize how bad it is, they may feel it doesn't make a difference to tell anyone.

Instead of only telling depressed people to reach out, be sure to try reaching out to people more often on your own initiative too. Check in with someone with no strings attached. Just yesterday I reached out to someone who is barely even an acquaintance, because she recently came out as trans and has been struggling with finances and mental health and mentioned it in passing - I can tell she's struggling even though she tries to be upbeat and positive most of the time. Every other day or so I send her a message that sounds like "Just wanted to say hi! I hope you're doing well, and please know you're cared for a lot."

This is just a friendly check in and a reminder that this person is valuable to me, without pressuring them into responding. Small check-ins like this can make a tremendous difference, especially because it didn't take that person actually putting energy into making that first step themselves - they can piggyback on your initial surge of energy so to speak. It can be incredibly tough to say "I need someone to talk to" and this helps a lot.

If you want people who are depressed and suicidal to get better, don't ask them to rely on just themselves to let you know when they need help. Look for signs that indicate depression, such as social withdrawal and isolation, start an open ended dialogue with no pressure for a response, remind them that they're unconditionally valued by you as a worthwhile human being, and offer them your help only if you're actually able to help them. (Don't hurt yourself in the process! You're allowed to have your own boundaries and limits.)

I do love it when people reach out, but I also recognize the value of being reached out to when you're the depressed person struggling to reach out to anyone. I love the warm and heartfelt responses on this topic, and I hope that this post can help complement the info here.